Jump to content
  • Sign in to follow this  

    andy666 Flysurfer Speed4 8M Review


    Traditional Speed Kite, Floaty & Grunty. A Great Kite. 

    Positives
    Exceptional Build Quality
    Increased Air Intake
    Infinity 2.0 Chicken Loop
    Negatives / Considerations
    Dislike FLS Safety System
    Excess Bar Travel Affects Steering
    No Floaty Jumps

    Picked up the new Flysurfer Speed 4 8m kite a week ago from Briskites. I went with the standard cloth rather then the delux cloth, because I figure if the wind is strong enough that I need an 8m kite, a light weight cloth really isn't needed ;)

    Since getting the kite I haven't been able to test fly it, so this is just a write up of my initial impressions of the kites build quality and features. Hopefully this week I will get a chance for a test fly and will write up another review after that.

    flysurfer-speed4-8m-kite-review-001.jpg

    Bag: Like most bags it has a zipper and buckles and the kite goes inside. The Flysurfer bag does this really well  

    Control Bar: The Speed 4 comes with the newer infinity 2 control bar, which has already been talked about a lot, so I won't go into too much detail about it. 

    The design of the bar is great. Large slots and thicker centre line should help maximise the life of the line, which was a problem with the Infinity 1 bar. The chicken loop has also been completely redesigned from the original Infinity 1 bar and should rotate a lot easier.

    One small complaint is that the finish on the bar doesn't look quite as good as the Infinity 1 bar, with excess glue and raggedy egdes on the foam.

    Small things I know.

    flysurfer-speed4-8m-kite-review-002.jpg

    Kite Build and Features: The build quality, like all Flysurfer kite, is exceptional. I'm a big fan of the new colour scheme, with the generous use of black cloth and contrasting red, the kite looks great.

    One of the biggest improvements to the Speed 4 is the addition of ribs in the leading edge. The ribs feel to be made from a flexible plastic tubing and help the kite keep the shape of the leading edge. The ribs start at the bottom skin and run around the leading edge to about 10" along the top skin. The true benefits of these ribs probably won't be obvious on the smaller sized Speeds were inflation and maintaining internal pressure shouldn't be a problem because of the higher wind speeds. However on the larger sizes these ribs should really help the kites low end.

    The pictures below shows how the leading edge holds it's shape and the intake vents open even when the kite has zero internal pressure.

    flysurfer-speed4-8m-kite-review-003.jpg

    flysurfer-speed4-8m-kite-review-004.jpg

    Another new addition that should help with low wind inflation are the so called X bridles. These are bridle lines that run to the centre of the intake valves to help hold them open.

    flysurfer-speed4-8m-kite-review-005.jpg

    It has been a long wait for the smaller sized speed kites. If they have anything like the outgoing speed 3's depower range and float they should be a fantastic kite :clapping:

    ---- ---- ---- ---- TEST FLY ---- ---- ---- ----

    Test flew the Flysurfer Speed 4 8m today for a few hours, riding a Peter Lynn buggy.

    I have been flying a 12m Speed 3 for a couple of years now and although it is hard to compare an 8m kite to a 12m, some comparisons can be made.

    Wind was cross onshore, starting at about 14knots (gust 19knots) picking up to 18knots (gust 22knots). On land, in the buggy, I felt that 17-18knots was about the mid range of the kite.

    Before the flight I had checked the mixer setting and line lengths, all were ok. 

    The factory mixer setting has the B bridles at +1cm and according to an addition page in the manual, is the optimum setting for the 8m and 10m Speed 4's

    The steering lines are delivered slightly longer then the front lines to allow for shrinkage, but I adjusted these (according to manual recommendations) to get the lines back to optimal length for the first flight.

    flysurfer-speed4-8m-kite-review-006.jpg

    General first impressions?........ Flysurfer FAIL!

    Launching: The kite launched ok from the centre of the window, with no pre-inflation (I never pre-inflate my speed 3 kites even the 15m in only 5knots).

    The 8m took longer then I expected to inflate and flaped around a bit until it did, but got there in the end with no big dramas.

    Landing: This is FAIL point of the 8m Speed 4. 

    When back stalled down to the middle of the wind window the kite still had quite a bit of pull and unlike the Speed 3, folds in on itself the more the back lines are pulled, the Speed 4's trailing edge started to catch the wind and looked like it could invert.

    When the safety is pulled and the kite is flagged out to the FLS, the kite begins flapping around and spinning, never actually coming to rest on the ground. This is the case no matter where the kite is in the window when the safety is pulled. Even when the kite is already back stalled and sitting on the ground, the kite picks up and flaps around. This flapping and spinning creates a large tangle in the bridle, which can take 5-10 minutes to undo. 

    The video doesn't show the worst landings I experienced, but they were the ones on recorded.

    Reverse Launch: This is one area where the Speed 4 was excellent. Simply pull on one of the steering lines and the kite flipped itself around and relaunched.

    Steering: In my opinion, this is the biggest FAIL for the Speed 4 and caused me nothing but frustration.

    The kite simply did NOT want to turn, unless the bar was pulled all the way in. Then turning speed was lightning fast and the kite can easily shoot the wrong way if you are not paying attention. For some this will be a benefit for unhooked kite loops, but that is not what I want and when jumping in the buggy the kite was hard to possition correctly.

    I tried moving the steering lines to the widest setting on the bar. Didn't help.

    I tried lengthening the front lines (which shortens the steering lines in comparison). Helped a little, but still not great. 

    I then adjusted the mixer to the flat profile, rather then the factory setting of B +1cm, which helped a bit more.

    Pulling the stopper ball down about 4 inches and limiting the bar travel was the only way that I could bet a slightly acceptable bar out turning ability

    It's my opinion that the bar travel on the 8m is too long and needs to be shortened or limited to allow the kite to turn.

    Pop and Float: The 8m Speed 4 has loads of pop and can send you skywards very easily and quickly. However there is non of the easy floaty hang time of the Speed 3. Understandably an 8m kite will not have the ability of a 12m kite, but there simply wasn't even a hint of it. Every time I left the ground I came crashing down. Perhaps with time and getting used to the kites turning speeds I can produce smoother landing, but it is not the simple ease of the Speed 3.

    Power and Up Wind: The power delivery can be a bit brutal with the Speed 4. Going from zero to rip you sideways in an instant. Most of this is due to the speed that the kite flies and can enter the power zone. Also the fact that the bar needs to be pulled all the way in to get decent turning speed. 

    The kites upwind ability is decent, not exceptional, which is suprising considering that the kite can easily fly completely out of the wind window on a redirect. 

    Final Thoughts: I am not completely disappointed with the 8m Speed 4, but not far off. Perhaps with time to learn the kite and some adjustment to improve the steering it will improve.

    For anyone, like myself, who was hoping that the 8m Speed 4 was going to be exactly like a small Speed 3, based on my first flight I would not recommend it. And if the larger sizes turn out to have the same traits as the 8m I think that I will be holding on to my Speed 3's.

    This of cause was only my first flight of the 8m Speed 4 and hopefully with time it will improve and I can do a more positive review.

    ---- ---- ---- ---- TEST FLY 2 ---- ---- ---- ----

    2nd Flight Review (with extended front lines)

    I had the 8m Speed 4 out again today, in about 13 knots of wind. For using in the buggy, this is definatly the low end of the kites usable wind range, however during the gusts I was still able to do small jumps.

    The extended front lines (7 inchs) that I fitted have literally tranformed the kite and it is now flying and steering brilliantly. In fact every aspect of the kites behaviour has improved, so I thought that I should do a quick 2nd flight review.

     

    Launching, Landing and Reverse Launch:

    All of these areas are pretty much unchanged from the first review, with lanching and reverse launch being great.

    Landing on the safty is still a painful experience, but I am working on a possible solution to this  ;)

     

    Steering:

    This is the area that has improved the most from having the extended front lines. Before, the kite had almost zero steering control with the bar all the way out or at half way. Then when the bar was pulled in the kite would turn very quickly. There just seemed to be no middle ground. 

    With the extended front lines, the kite now has far better steering control through the entire throw of the bar. Plus the steering is now more balanced, being able to easily moderate between slow lazy turns or quick kite loops.

     

    Pop and Float:

    It was hard to tell from todays light wind flight, but perhaps some of the kites "pop" has been reduced by having the longer front lines. However, the kite has definatly improved in the float department and didn't tend to drop me suddenly, like it did before. For me personally, this is what I want in a kite and it is a great improvement.

     

    Final Thoughts:

    By extending the front lines on the 8m Speed 4 I may have lost some of the kites top end depower ability, but in my opinion the benefits far outway the negative.

    At the end of my first flight review I said that I was almost completely disappointed with the kite and that I wouldn't recommend it. Well, that has completely changed. The 8m Speed 4 (with extended front lines) flys and feels more like a traditional Speed kite, floaty and grunty. A great kite, that I can recommend  :good:



      Report Review
    Sign in to follow this  


    User Feedback




    jabroni

    Posted

    Do the ribs get in the way when rolling the kite up?

    I like the + - on the power/depower straps now too.

    Share this comment


    Link to comment
    Share on other sites
    andy666

    Posted

    Do the ribs get in the way when rolling the kite up?

    I was a little worried about that too, but they don't cause any problems. The ribs are nice and flexible and the kite rolls up like they aren't even there.

    Share this comment


    Link to comment
    Share on other sites
    andy666

    Posted

    First flight review posted above.

    Share this comment


    Link to comment
    Share on other sites
    SoutherlyBuster

    Posted

    Sad to hear that you are not that happy with the kite Andy.

    I haven't had a chance to view the vids yet (net nanny at work stops me). As for the turning speed, I had the same problem with Zach's Speed 1.5 7m^2, Zach almost gave up with it. I then did the mixer test and it was quite a bit out, once that was fixed steering was fine (zero setting). The fellow who did the convertion from the 1 to 1.5 release said if the mixer test does not do the trick, from memory he suggested adjust the z-extender. Also pulling in the bar to turn the kite, arggg, that would really annoy me -- Zach's Speed 1.5 before the mixer test adjustment behaved the same way.

    I would be inclined to send FlySurfer an email and see what their response is.

    Regards,

    Norman.

    Share this comment


    Link to comment
    Share on other sites
    andy666

    Posted

    Yeah, I have sent an email off to flysurfer and Jason (briskites) is also looking into it for me.

    Hopefully it is an easy fix... Or it could just be a matter of me learning a new kite.

    Share this comment


    Link to comment
    Share on other sites
    SoutherlyBuster

    Posted

    Andy,

    Just looked at the vids. The flagging out when landing, well personally I find both the Speed III 12m^2 and the Psycho IV 10m^2 to potentially cause a bit of a mess with the lines. I only use that method as a last resort. As for the kite still have some pull when flagged out, the Psycho will still have some pull, but manageable -- it's fifth line arrangement and just folds in half, so the kite is not really going any where.

    When I land, I always land the kite on the side of the wind window, gently pulling on the rear lines to stall it (Arc style -- are you having a chuckle Nigel), then with a bit of luck the two wing tips touch and it falls in a heap on the ground, or it drifts down down a bit, I then just do a hand over hand on the rear lines until I get to the kite to secure it. On exposed beaches if the above does not do the trick, I'll then flag it out.

    The lack of turning video, exactly what Zach's Speed 1.5 was doing before I did the mixer test.

    Share this comment


    Link to comment
    Share on other sites
    andy666

    Posted

    The flag out isn't a big issue. It's just scary that the kite was still spinning 3m off the ground then slamming down hard enough that I could hear that sickening thump sound like when you nose dive a kite.

    Share this comment


    Link to comment
    Share on other sites
    SoutherlyBuster

    Posted

    The flag out isn't a big issue. It's just scary that the kite was still spinning 3m off the ground then slamming down hard enough that I could hear that sickening thump sound like when you nose dive a kite.

    Right .... the thump puts it into perspective, that does not sound right.

    Share this comment


    Link to comment
    Share on other sites
    Goz

    Posted

    Bummer that your inital sessions with the speed 4 haven't lived up to your expectations Andy. I would give it a few more sessions to bed in and for all the lines to stretch a bit, as i recall I had issues with my Speed3 when I got it and once it all bedded in after a few sessions it all seemed to come good.

    Share this comment


    Link to comment
    Share on other sites
    jabroni

    Posted

    Another review. Look at the pictures to read...

    https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set ... 569&type=1

    Depower:

    Now here comes the only concern so far:

    The range is HUGE. But the 2/3 of the rope are enough to completly depower the kite. The last 1/3 is just nice to have.

    So you have to get use to it, that you generate much more power/depower on shorter travel way of the bar. But ones this is mastered. You will love it. It feels strange for the first 5 minutes.

    Then it's mastered and it works really perfect.

    We came up with this: for starting and landing we use the full depower rope. As soon as we are on the water, we pull the stopper 1/3 down and have a perfect working system. This will be super for shorter kiters and also for kids and kite girls.

    Share this comment


    Link to comment
    Share on other sites
    andy666

    Posted

    Ok, bit of an update.

    During the week I received a reply from flysurfer regarding the complete lack of steering with the bar out.

    Quote
    Dear Andrew,

    Thank you for your Mail and feedback.

    Yes, this is normal because of the huge depower range of the SPEED4.

    If you want to have more steering control, you can shorten the depower/sliverline to a total measurement

    of 40 cm.

    (measured from top side of chickenloop to lower side of adjuster. )

    You can also loop the steering-leader-lines twice. We do not recommended but it helps for sure.

    Viele Grüße aus Grassau / Best regards

    Peter Müller

    Workshop supervisor

    I had already measure the bar throw and it was set at the correct 40cm so that was not the problem.

    Shortening the rear lines in my opinion is a dodge work around, especially since flysurfer have such detailed instructions about setting them up at equal lengths, but it looked like my only option.

    Looping the steering lines I knew wouldn't shorten the rears enough, so I replaced the black rope about the trim strap with a longer piece. This lengthened the front lines by a massive 7 inches (which shortens the rears in comparison).

    flysurfer-speed4-8m-kite-review-007.jpg

    I only had about 7-8 knots of wind to test the new setup. But even in this light wind, with the trim strap out and bar in, the kite only just back stalled which is normal when flying so under powered. With the bar out the back lines were still a little slack, so I shouldn't have lost any depower range. And the best part is that I now have MUCH better steering control :D

    It will probably take some fine tuning in higher winds, but already I am a lot happier with the kite. This is how it should have been from the start.

    Share this comment


    Link to comment
    Share on other sites
    SoutherlyBuster

    Posted

    Andy,

    After reading the review from the Swiss riders, they were impressed by the turning capability, but they flew the kite towards the top end of the kite. Also from their write up and from your explanations, it appears that the last 1/3 of depower is there for supper depower but not necessarily good for steering, the oh no wind gust too high setting; then have the depower 2/3 out and the steering comes back. They did say it felt a bit strange at first but then got used to it.

    Actually I thought 18 knots for a 8m^2 FlySurfer was very much on the low end. With my Psycho IV 10m^2, 15 to 18 is the low end for the water action. But even in lighter winds on the land, the Psycho IV 10m^2 still turns fast.

    Interestingly enough the Swiss riders thought the Speed IV was a good replacement for the Psycho IV's.

    Maybe it's a case of getting used to the new way of flying it.

    Regards,

    Norman

    Share this comment


    Link to comment
    Share on other sites
    andy666

    Posted

    Yes on water 18knots would be the low end for the 8m, but in a buggy you can't hold as much power because its impossible to edge hard against the kite. It's probably a matter of tuning the kite for the intended use.

    Share this comment


    Link to comment
    Share on other sites
    andy666

    Posted

    2nd Flight Review (with extended front lines)

    I had the 8m Speed 4 out again today, in about 13 knots of wind. For using in the buggy, this is definatly the low end of the kites usable wind range, however during the gusts I was still able to do small jumps.

    The extended front lines (7 inchs) that I fitted have literally tranformed the kite and it is now flying and steering brilliantly. In fact every aspect of the kites behaviour has improved, so I thought that I should do a quick 2nd flight review.

    Launching, Landing and Reverse Launch:

    All of these areas are pretty much unchanged from the first review, with lanching and reverse launch being great.

    Landing on the safty is still a painful experience, but I am working on a possible solution to this ;)

    Steering:

    This is the area that has improved the most from having the extended front lines. Before, the kite had almost zero steering control with the bar all the way out or at half way. Then when the bar was pulled in the kite would turn very quickly. There just seemed to be no middle ground.

    With the extended front lines, the kite now has far better steering control through the entire throw of the bar. Plus the steering is now more balanced, being able to easily moderate between slow lazy turns or quick kite loops.

    Pop and Float:

    It was hard to tell from todays light wind flight, but perhaps some of the kites "pop" has been reduced by having the longer front lines. However, the kite has definatly improved in the float department and didn't tend to drop me suddenly, like it did before. For me personally, this is what I want in a kite and it is a great improvement.

    Final Thoughts:

    By extending the front lines on the 8m Speed 4 I may have lost some of the kites top end depower ability, but in my opinion the benefits far outway the negative.

    At the end of my first flight review I said that I was almost completely disappointed with the kite and that I wouldn't recommend it. Well, that has completely changed. The 8m Speed 4 (with extended front lines) flys and feels more like a traditional Speed kite, floaty and grunty. A great kite, that I can recommend :good:

    Share this comment


    Link to comment
    Share on other sites
    Goz

    Posted

    Good to hear you got it sorted and your getting along with your kite now Andy. I would imagine after the front lines stretch a bit and everything beds in you will probably have to shorten or remove that extension.

    Share this comment


    Link to comment
    Share on other sites
    Armin Harich

    Posted

    Hello Andy666

    Sorry, that you was disappointed with the first flights. Let me give some background info from the developers point of view.

    The SPEED4 has very short and direct depower and travelranges. It need a bit time to get used to it, as that is a bit unique.But after it can happen that you feel your arms are not long enough for other kites.

    Maybe it is to direct from some people. We will carefully watch the feedback after they have flown it a few times. From our Experience, people get used to it after a few sessions. That the “sweet Spot” of the depower is at the right place is the important key!

    While riding powered up with more tension in the lines like kiting on water, the frontlines stretch and power up the kites more. Riding in a buggy is usually with less power and shortening the backlines for the first session is needed.

    To adjust that, we recommend shortening the Backlines. If you extend the frontlines with more than the standard Depowerleaderline allow, the FLS-Line can pull down one flyingline, which is not good.

    To have a faster/easier adjustment for the frontlines is on our To Do list for the future.

    Saftey:

    We know, that the Saftey is not perfect. We compared it with the FDS, and the FLS had a better relaunch ability. Other safety options are in development, but so far we have no option that work in overall better. If you find one, let us know.

    Backstall Landing:

    If we improved the backstall landing, other points get worse. We balanced than a compromise but focused more on turning and flying.

    We will go on to listen carefully to the feedback. I hope, this info will help a bit.

    Thank you, Armin

    Share this comment


    Link to comment
    Share on other sites
    Clive

    Posted

    Good to see you have it up and running, from my very limited experience with depowers, it seems line adjustments are a bit of a change one you need to change them all, but you can't do it on the fly.

    You will have to show us some of your jumping vids, it was a long time ago I saw one, found it jan this year( too long) . You did a 360 on the run, something I have tried with very poor results. It'd be good to see how you've progressed.

    Just watched the vids...... Spaghettified lines, not much fun, one of my access kites did that to me ( after one of the knots pulled through a pulley and it went into a death spiral followed by a drag up the beach and a tumbled mess) you have my sympathy, but I just gave up on it for the day and got another kite out in disgust.

    Share this comment


    Link to comment
    Share on other sites
    andy666

    Posted

    To adjust that, we recommend shortening the Backlines. If you extend the frontlines with more than the standard Depowerleaderline allow, the FLS-Line can pull down one flyingline, which is not good.

    yeah, I realised this when I stretched the lines out to check how much I had extended them, so I spliced up an extension for the safty line as well. I forgot to mention that in the previous posts.

    Share this comment


    Link to comment
    Share on other sites
    andy666

    Posted

    You will have to show us some of your jumping vids, it was a long time ago I saw one, found it jan this year( too long) . You did a 360 on the run, something I have tried with very poor results. It'd be good to see how you've progressed.

    I haven't kited much this year, so not a lot of progression. The only real improvements are that I now throw my sidewinders harder, enough that the back wheel rubs on the kite lines. I also did a tombstone for the first time the other day, which is basically just during a jump move to a standing position over the front pegs.

    With the 360's I find it easiest to do going slightly down wind. You also need a decent amount of speed and really commit to flicking the buggy around. I started by just throwing the buggy into a hard slide to come to a stop, that ended up with me facing the opposite direction. Then just learn to carry a bit more speed and flick the front wheel at the right time to complete the rotation.

    Share this comment


    Link to comment
    Share on other sites
    fodendeyo

    Posted

    Now you hane had the kite a bit longer Andy are you still happy with it? Any updates on how it is performing? Does it suit buggying?

    Share this comment


    Link to comment
    Share on other sites
    andy666

    Posted

    Damn you flysurfer, why can't you make a safety system that doesn't turn my kite into a tangled mess :diablo::diablo::diablo:

    Share this comment


    Link to comment
    Share on other sites
    Northern Kites Australia

    Posted

    Hi Andy,

    I read your reviews with great interest, but I cannot see the links to your videos. Would you mind posting me a link or utube link?

    I have an offer from someone on Seabreeze for a Flysurfer Speed 4 15mt. But after reading the issues you had, I am worried I may come across similar problems. And knowing my patience dept with expensive gear, it had better work! LOL

    I already own a Psycho III 8mt and have been land kiting it more than using it on water. I have to say, the steering on her is shoddy at best but I do need to do a mixer test to be sure it's not anything else. Might do it today actually, as I've been putting it off for too long.

    Anyway, I am keen on purchasing this FS Speed4 but yeah I am a bit dubious. A local here who is very good with kiting overall, hates them. He reckons the Speed 3 are a much better kite. He also said it was due to poor steering abilities.

    Share this comment


    Link to comment
    Share on other sites
    andy666

    Posted

    hi lofty.

    I bet you are trying to view the page on an iOS device like an iPad and the reason the videos don't appear is because embedded vimeo are flash based and not compatible with iOS.

    Here's a link to a page I started with a way around the problem. http://www.extremekites.com.au/forums/viewtopic.php?f=19&t=17463&hilit=vimeo

    And since I'm a nice person here are also the links to my videos from the review.

    Launching:

    Landing:

    Reverse Launch:

    Steering:

    Also mate, read further down the page to the 2nd flight review after I had extended the front lines, which fixed most of the problems (except the landing)

    As for someone on seabreeze having a 15m speed 4 for sale? I would say that its 99% chance a rip off. Only the 8m and 10m Speed 4 have been released. The larger sizes are still pre order only. The only person in Australia who might have one is luke southern in Sydney, as he is a flysurfer team rider and might have a pre production model.

    When they are released, the larger speed 4 will not have the same issue as the 8m and 10m as the have different bridling. infact the large speed 4 should behave very much like the speed 3 because it has almost exactly the same canopy and bridle design, just a better cloth.

    Share this comment


    Link to comment
    Share on other sites
    SoutherlyBuster

    Posted

    Hi Lofty,

    First thing, do a mixer test that rules out all other possibilities. My son Zac has the FlySurfer Speed 1.5 7m^2, it was terrible at turning, then did the mixer test and it was better, but still not any thing like the Speed III 12m^2 or the Psycho IV 10m^2 I have. I've had to change the steering method to get it (Speed 1.5 7m^2) to work.

    Now back to the Speed IV's. I know Andy666 had troubles with his, but both Zac and I tried Joel's Speed IV 8m^2 and loved it, I don't believe Joel did any mods to it. I liked it so much I bought one, due to arrive coming week. As Andy said the Speed IV 10m^2 and smaller are different to the Speed IV 12m^2 and above. The Speed IV's in the larger sizes are in the Lotus cloth, very pricey. If there was an issue with the steering of the new flysurfers I would have spotted this and not have bought another one. I can understand why some people would hate them if they flew the older designs, ie Speed I, but the Psycho IV, Speed III and Speed IV steer fast, plenty of power, great up wind, plenty of float. The power delivery on the Speed IV 8m^2 is very smooth, you can fly it like a limo or a cut snake, the choice is yours.

    Hope that helps.

    Regards,

    Norman.

    Share this comment


    Link to comment
    Share on other sites
    Tiger37

    Posted

    H

    I can understand why some people would hate them if they flew the older designs, ie Speed I, but the Psycho IV, Speed III and Speed IV steer fast, plenty of power, great up wind, plenty of float.

    Hope that helps.

    Regards,

    Norman.

    I take it from this that the older Speed 1s are not a good kite? Only reason I ask is that there is a 10m Speed 1 for sale at $300 ONO that caught my eye.

    Share this comment


    Link to comment
    Share on other sites



    Create an account or sign in to comment

    You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

    Create an account

    Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

    Register a new account

    Sign in

    Already have an account? Sign in here.

    Sign In Now



×